Moho Forum

OK ~~

So I think I've finally come to grips with the whole drawing in vector graphics thing. So now I'm at a point were I'd like to develop a style and actually try to create real stuff. Toward that end, here's a simple character design.



I've been tossing around this design for some time in my head now, but here she finally made it out into cyberspace. Obviously, this character is pure fantasy. I call her the "changeling" becuase she is this troll-like character ~~ switched at birth with a human child along the lines of those old scandinavian legends. The idea is to portray a juxtaposition of beauty and what would be regarded as stereotypically "not beauty". I'm aiming to invert the hero/monster stereotype and create a story that turns black and white to shades of grey (a sort of Beowulf from Grendle's POV) kinda thing.

So the first problem I have is the skirt. How do you manage cloth effects in AS? I have a feeling this is gonna cause me problems down the line...

So, um, Slowtiger ~~ I'm wondering if you ever were able to dig out those examples you mentioned in a previous thread. I'd really luv' to see 'em as I continue to try to develop my style. And I'm sure there are many other readers of this forum that would love to see 'em too....

Dr. Nick wrote:O...here's a simple character design....

...I'm aiming to invert the hero/monster stereotype...

Hey, I think anybody who can draw convincingly in AS is already a winner. Nice work!

I'd just like to point out that if you can render this figure with a brushline of varying thickness, you will bring the work up to another standard of quality.

You asked about cloth. I recently did a little test with clothing, trying to figure out the secondary motion. It was a very minor thing, but successful. If you imagine:

- the cloth at rest
- then carried along with moving limbs
- then colliding with the leading edge of an arm or leg at an extreme
- then trailing behind during the return motion
- then settling to rest

you should be able to pull it of.

As for inverting the monster, I assume you realize the most wildly popular variation of this (rather rare!) theme is the musical Wicked.

Here are some examples I found:


This is one of the Big Knights, nicely done cutout animation made in a vector application. http://www.thebigknights.net/ has more screenshots under "media". A style like this is easily done in AS, most body parts are stiff and can be layer bound, for arms and legs you have the choice to make them flexible or out of seoarate stiff parts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELLFgmD2zo4
Wickie is one of the many Toho productions of the 70's. In its simplicity and reduced animation it should be possible to get translated into AS as well. The lines are of equal thickness, but (in the original) have that pencil quality I like so much.


http://www.kingfeatures.com/license/lip ... /MainB.htm
This one (you know) has a loose line which could be translated into AS but asks for more full animation.

I was looking for some character with a more lively outline, but found none. I think you don't need any example for an anime/disney animation style.

You should better think about what kind of story you want to tell, and to whom, instead of worrying about cloth movements too much ... Did you have the character in mind, or did you have that image of your character in mind? That's a big difference. IMO it helps to develop stuff like this with broad tools like a smooth pencil or a thick brush (for colour sketches) on paper. Go for extremes. Make your characters really separate from each other.

Imagine your troll girl inside a whole village full of people. Do other girls look like her? If the only difference is the teeth and the bikini colour, then your story will not work. Girls come in a lot of different shapes. Try to create some 7 girls, each of them an individuum, and then place your troll girl amongst them. In which parts is she different, where is she the same?

Thanks very much for the feedback so far.

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Human ~~ if you feel like taking the time to post your cloth experiment ~~ it'd be great to see. Interesting how you break down the flow...

RE:

As for inverting the monster, I assume you realize the most wildly popular variation of this (rather rare!) theme is the musical Wicked.

Actually, I read the book Wicked ~~ it's quite good really and the ending does make you think. I also read a book a loong time ago (more years than I care to count) which told the story of Beowulf from Grendel's point of view. It was a great treatment as I recall. Recently I also saw the movie Beowulf and Grendel, which, again, portrayed the story from a different perspective than the usual white hat, black hat treatment of things. A decent watch if you like that sort of thing (warning, my all time favorite literary works ever were Lord of the Rings, and, of course same goes for cinema).

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Thanks for the images Slowtiger. The Knight is definitely highly stylized and I can see where it would fit quite well into the VG/Bones system for creating anims.

What I'm aiming for, though, is something that gets a bit away from the sort of complete western cartoony feel of the Mickey Mousey sort of early fleisher stuff (remember Betty Boop and later Popeye, bluto, sea hag et al.)? I'm trying to get sort of the right blend of a Japanese Anime style / western sort of harder line stylized look that lends itself to action scenes and interesting kinematic effects. I LOVE what I've seen on this forum from La Reine Soleil. I mean, obviously that stuff's just gorgeous! (How do we get that, by the way? I want to learn French now just so I can get a copy and watch it!) Are those characters drawn in AS using VG?

RE:

Did you have the character in mind, or did you have that image of your character in mind? That's a big difference.

Actually ~~ it's both. I have the image in my mind's eye but I also have the charcter. I want to try to project a strong character who can overcome the odds. I'm interested in trying to portray action sequences ~~ sort of the sorts of things you'd see Michelle Yoh do in Crounching Tiger Hidden Dragon ~~ that sort of thing. But the story has to reveal why you should care about the character ~~ what's her redeming quality that makes her less the monster type...

But I ~really~ like your suggestion toward character development. Putting her in a line-up of other characters from the village. It'll help me continue to develop a style and maybe give me a few more rigs I can use at the same time (I'm always about killing two birds with one stone...)

Thanks!