Moho Forum

I like that style!

Great combination of both.

-vern

Gee, I hate to keep chiming in after Vern all the time, but I just wanted to say that I agree--this version is stylistically better than either of the previous two versions.

It was already great work, but this is even greater!

I like outlines, myself. I tend to like bold black outlines, and use them generally in my work, but of the three versions you posted, I think the last one looks the best.

I just saw this thread today, and this rig is very interesting. Good work.

The first one is much better IMHO. I get the meaning, and I agree that some lines are sperfluous. Great artwork by the way. Looks better with the lines. This is not a criticism. Just an observation Wish I could draw like that!!!

Did another character (two, kind of) for the project I've been working on; I've been playing with thicker outlines in the places where I do use them, treating them more like shading (I got the idea from Human and Vern's conversation above, of course). It looks alright in places, but I feel like it clashes with more detailed places that call for thinner lines (namely the face). I might be able to even it out if I put some more lines in places like the hands or feet... any opinions on this?

The Gryphonkeeper:

http://foxmage.com/GryphonAndKeeper.anme

She's just a modification of the template I made for the last character. The gryphon itself uses a lot of the same concepts ("control" bones are its neck, base of its tail, and end of its beak). Its wings... gah, I hate doing wings in AS. They're unwieldy but in the final product I won't be doing much with them ayway.

Comments, criticisms, etc. welcome.

If I may stray from your request for comments on strokes?

I would be concerned that the anime hairdo may detract from your terrific fox/jackal guy.

As for the gryphon, I assume this is still quite early and you're working to refine it. History is full of gryphons, and they tend to have lots and lots of character. The best gryphon is possibly John Tenniel's illo for the Lewis Carroll books.

human wrote:As for the gryphon, I assume this is still quite early and you're working to refine it. History is full of gryphons, and they tend to have lots and lots of character. The best gryphon is possibly John Tenniel's illo for the Lewis Carroll books.

I'm not aiming to be too historically/mythically accurate (I've already mixed a bit of manticore in there) but you're right about it needing a bit more character, perhaps. Namely, I'd say a bit more "bird of prey" and a bit less "pidgin".

I found some of Tenniel's illustrations - nice stuff indeed. I'll work on the gryph a bit more tomorrow.

human wrote:I would be concerned that the anime hairdo may detract from your terrific fox/jackal guy.

Actually, I was aiming to make the Gryphonkeeper a fox/jackal girl. I thought I changed the body shape and face enough to make her more feminine, but if it trips people up I see that as a sign it needs work =P. Voices will inevitably clear up any confusion, but I'd hate for my voice actors to be the only way to tell genders apart.

Anyway, as for the hair, can you clarify what you mean by "detract from"? These are based off designs I did a while ago and I don't want them to clash too badly with my normal art style (which, sadly, has long since been corrupted by the evil that is anime hair). Of course, designs can be changed easily, but I'm not sure I understand your comment about the hair.

Kazerad wrote:

human wrote:Actually, I was aiming to make the Gryphonkeeper a fox/jackal girl. I thought I changed the body shape and face enough to make her more feminine.

Anyway, as for the hair, can you clarify what you mean by "detract from"? These are based off designs

Hmmm, well, sorry, I guess I get confused easily.

Apparently you've been working on two characters in parallel and I didn't realize that.

Now that I see the boob lines I understand about the other character.

Speaking personally, I like the graceful lock of hair on the Jackal but even when I see your original model for Gryphonkeeper I think the hair over the eyes detracts away from the appeal of her face. Less hair, I urge you, less hair--at least in front.

Just one other thing... again speaking personally... your bitmap models obey the anime genre standards pretty rigorously I suppose, but I like the greater stylization of your simple angular models.

But don't let my personal taste interfere... it's a drag to do that to people (as I have learned)....

Kazerad,
I love the bold style and colouring of your characters nice job... and i'm still intrigued by your rigging method - i bet it will add a lot of life to show 3D-esque rotation when animating... even though its not full turns i think it will add a lot of subtlety and a professional finish.

Cant wait to see a test animation! and thanks for sharing your files

human wrote:Hmmm, well, sorry, I guess I get confused easily.

No need to apologize; my attitude towards art is that the "viewer can't be wrong". If someone misinterprets something, it's a sign that I'm not making things clear enough. Hence, everyone's opinion is important, even if it's "wrong".

I gave her a trim. Would you say the hair is less distracting now?

Kazerad wrote:I gave her a trim. Would you say the hair is less distracting now?

I'm not sure what you did, but I love it. Go for it.

I want comment that I would like some outlines to her hands. Just to separate one finger form other.
Good job.

Kazerad,
I assume that you made the hair transparent to keep the eyebrows showing through, as in anime style. Personally I'd like to see the hair as an opaque layer, Just to clear up some of the 'busyness' on the face. In other words i think that the hair is a bit confusing to the viewer.
Brilliant work however. I love the use of position constraints!

Kazerad wrote:]These rigs are mostly me testing ideas for how to get complex characters to move without looking robotic. To get full control you need a mix of "Manipulate Bones", "Translate Bones", and "Scale Bones", though all the mechanisms are fairly simple.

I don't think I've ever made a model with more than four layers before.

I have a question: how did you come about the numbers that you plugged into the bone constraints? Was it via trial and error, or was there some mathematical formula involved?